New features.

(Chapter 7 and beyond)

Re: New features.

Postby Shenmue_Legend » Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:32 am

Mr.Jigen wrote:
drunkensailor wrote:
KidMarine wrote: To be honest, it doesn't really make much sense for the latest arcade games (for 1987) to be in some very remote village in China. Maybe some old pinball machines from the 50s or something.
ryo is also visiting major cities in this part. besides owning a sega saturn in 1986 made no sense either. the game isn't trying to be realistic this way. it needs to be fun.


My exact thoughts the game needs to be fun first, this was TLOU's biggest flaw in my opinion a game needs to be more than story and setting it wouldn't be Shenmue otherwise.


And there in lies the problem with modern gamers (not aimed at you specifically so please don't take it personally!). They want their games to be "fun". Well you know, there are other things that go into making a game special and great. If you want pure fun, Call Of Duty is the answer. It's like the forklift job and other stuff in the first Shenmue that people thought was "tedious and boring" but that's part of the immersion. In life, there are many things you hate doing that need to be done. What sets apart the best games from the rest is that they don't aim to be "fun", they aim to provide a magical and legendary experience that will be remembered. Whether they're fun in the process or not, doesn't matter. At this point, they become "experiences" rather than video games. True works of art. And speaking of art, it's like if someone drawn a detailed picture of someone taking a dump! Sure it may be funny and entertaining, but it only provides temporary and instant "fun" that won't serve any purpose other than entertainment and won't be remembered (and if it is, it's not because it was special!). Compare that with an elaborate painting of Bob Ross or some other artist, which will give you that "wow" factor and it'll be magical and something truly stunning that'll serve a higher purpose than just providing entertainment. Know what I'm saying?!
User avatar
Shenmue_Legend
Banned
Banned
 
Joined: August 2017

Re: New features.

Postby Mr.Jigen » Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:05 pm

Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
drunkensailor wrote:
KidMarine wrote: To be honest, it doesn't really make much sense for the latest arcade games (for 1987) to be in some very remote village in China. Maybe some old pinball machines from the 50s or something.
ryo is also visiting major cities in this part. besides owning a sega saturn in 1986 made no sense either. the game isn't trying to be realistic this way. it needs to be fun.


My exact thoughts the game needs to be fun first, this was TLOU's biggest flaw in my opinion a game needs to be more than story and setting it wouldn't be Shenmue otherwise.


And there in lies the problem with modern gamers (not aimed at you specifically so please don't take it personally!). They want their games to be "fun". Well you know, there are other things that go into making a game special and great. If you want pure fun, Call Of Duty is the answer. It's like the forklift job and other stuff in the first Shenmue that people thought was "tedious and boring" but that's part of the immersion. In life, there are many things you hate doing that need to be done. What sets apart the best games from the rest is that they don't aim to be "fun", they aim to provide a magical and legendary experience that will be remembered. Whether they're fun in the process or not, doesn't matter. At this point, they become "experiences" rather than video games. True works of art. And speaking of art, it's like if someone drawn a detailed picture of someone taking a dump! Sure it may be funny and entertaining, but it only provides temporary and instant "fun" that won't serve any purpose other than entertainment and won't be remembered (and if it is, it's not because it was special!). Compare that with an elaborate painting of Bob Ross or some other artist, which will give you that "wow" factor and it'll be magical and something truly stunning that'll serve a higher purpose than just providing entertainment. Know what I'm saying?!


I wholeheartedly disagree with you.
User avatar
Mr.Jigen
Funny Bear Burger Clerk
Funny Bear Burger Clerk
 
Joined: December 2017
Location: United States
XBL: Onettown
Nintendo FC: Joeython
Steam: ThatOneGuyWhoPlaysGa
Favorite title: Shenmue
Currently playing: Shenmue

Re: New features.

Postby Shenmue_Legend » Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:27 pm

Mr.Jigen wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
drunkensailor wrote:
KidMarine wrote: To be honest, it doesn't really make much sense for the latest arcade games (for 1987) to be in some very remote village in China. Maybe some old pinball machines from the 50s or something.
ryo is also visiting major cities in this part. besides owning a sega saturn in 1986 made no sense either. the game isn't trying to be realistic this way. it needs to be fun.


My exact thoughts the game needs to be fun first, this was TLOU's biggest flaw in my opinion a game needs to be more than story and setting it wouldn't be Shenmue otherwise.


And there in lies the problem with modern gamers (not aimed at you specifically so please don't take it personally!). They want their games to be "fun". Well you know, there are other things that go into making a game special and great. If you want pure fun, Call Of Duty is the answer. It's like the forklift job and other stuff in the first Shenmue that people thought was "tedious and boring" but that's part of the immersion. In life, there are many things you hate doing that need to be done. What sets apart the best games from the rest is that they don't aim to be "fun", they aim to provide a magical and legendary experience that will be remembered. Whether they're fun in the process or not, doesn't matter. At this point, they become "experiences" rather than video games. True works of art. And speaking of art, it's like if someone drawn a detailed picture of someone taking a dump! Sure it may be funny and entertaining, but it only provides temporary and instant "fun" that won't serve any purpose other than entertainment and won't be remembered (and if it is, it's not because it was special!). Compare that with an elaborate painting of Bob Ross or some other artist, which will give you that "wow" factor and it'll be magical and something truly stunning that'll serve a higher purpose than just providing entertainment. Know what I'm saying?!


I wholeheartedly disagree with you.


Elaborate.
User avatar
Shenmue_Legend
Banned
Banned
 
Joined: August 2017

Re: New features.

Postby south carmain » Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:31 pm

Shenmue_Legend wrote:Know what I'm saying?!

I now imagine you as being butters from south park
phpBB [video]

south carmain has received a thanks from: Shenmue_Legend
User avatar
south carmain
Comrade of the motherland
"Keep Friends"
 
Joined: February 2012
Favorite title: Shenmue IIx
Currently playing: okami hd

Re: New features.

Postby sand4fish » Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:09 pm

Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
I wholeheartedly disagree with you.


Elaborate.


It needs to be fun. So... more gun play, car chases and explosions. Maybe Ryo dual wielding katanas could be an alternative to shooting, just for the sake of keeping the martial arts thematic. And as Shenmue isn't trying to be realistic because of a Sega Saturn in 1986, a smartphone with game apps and GPS pre-installed would be convenient too. That would solve the problem of no arcade games in rural China.
User avatar
sand4fish
"After Burner...Great!"
"After Burner...Great!"
 
Joined: November 2013
Favorite title: Shenmue

Re: New features.

Postby Shenmue_Legend » Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:17 pm

sand4fish wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
I wholeheartedly disagree with you.


Elaborate.


It needs to be fun. So... more gun play, car chases and explosions. Maybe Ryo dual wielding katanas could be an alternative to shooting, just for the sake of keeping the martial arts thematic. And as Shenmue isn't trying to be realistic because of a Sega Saturn in 1986, a smartphone with game apps and GPS pre-installed would be convenient too. That would solve the problem of no arcade games in rural China.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! I know you're only joking, but I bet Mr. Jigen isn't. His idea of "fun" in Shenmue III probably isn't far off :D But I can't know for sure until he "elaborates"!
User avatar
Shenmue_Legend
Banned
Banned
 
Joined: August 2017

Re: New features.

Postby Mr.Jigen » Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:20 pm

Shenmue_Legend wrote:
sand4fish wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
I wholeheartedly disagree with you.


Elaborate.


It needs to be fun. So... more gun play, car chases and explosions. Maybe Ryo dual wielding katanas could be an alternative to shooting, just for the sake of keeping the martial arts thematic. And as Shenmue isn't trying to be realistic because of a Sega Saturn in 1986, a smartphone with game apps and GPS pre-installed would be convenient too. That would solve the problem of no arcade games in rural China.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! I know you're only joking, but I bet Mr. Jigen isn't. His idea of "fun" in Shenmue III probably isn't far off :D But I can't know for sure until he "elaborates"!


You really want this to be like that, not everyone who disagrees with you is automatically stupid.
User avatar
Mr.Jigen
Funny Bear Burger Clerk
Funny Bear Burger Clerk
 
Joined: December 2017
Location: United States
XBL: Onettown
Nintendo FC: Joeython
Steam: ThatOneGuyWhoPlaysGa
Favorite title: Shenmue
Currently playing: Shenmue

Re: New features.

Postby Shenmue_Legend » Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:22 pm

Mr.Jigen wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
sand4fish wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
I wholeheartedly disagree with you.


Elaborate.


It needs to be fun. So... more gun play, car chases and explosions. Maybe Ryo dual wielding katanas could be an alternative to shooting, just for the sake of keeping the martial arts thematic. And as Shenmue isn't trying to be realistic because of a Sega Saturn in 1986, a smartphone with game apps and GPS pre-installed would be convenient too. That would solve the problem of no arcade games in rural China.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! I know you're only joking, but I bet Mr. Jigen isn't. His idea of "fun" in Shenmue III probably isn't far off :D But I can't know for sure until he "elaborates"!


You really want this to be like that, not everyone who disagrees with you is automatically stupid.


I never said you were stupid. And yes you're free to disagree with me but you didn't even explain why!
User avatar
Shenmue_Legend
Banned
Banned
 
Joined: August 2017

Re: New features.

Postby Mr.Jigen » Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:24 pm

Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
sand4fish wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
I wholeheartedly disagree with you.


Elaborate.


It needs to be fun. So... more gun play, car chases and explosions. Maybe Ryo dual wielding katanas could be an alternative to shooting, just for the sake of keeping the martial arts thematic. And as Shenmue isn't trying to be realistic because of a Sega Saturn in 1986, a smartphone with game apps and GPS pre-installed would be convenient too. That would solve the problem of no arcade games in rural China.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! I know you're only joking, but I bet Mr. Jigen isn't. His idea of "fun" in Shenmue III probably isn't far off :D But I can't know for sure until he "elaborates"!


You really want this to be like that, not everyone who disagrees with you is automatically stupid.


I never said you were stupid. And yes you're free to disagree with me but you didn't even explain why!


Games are not paintings, they are interactive experiences in my opinion something like Pac-Man would trump something like the telltale Walking Dead series. These are not games they are movies with very basic interaction if I wanted a movie I'd go to the theater.

Shenmue has the aspect of uniqueness, driving a forklift may not be fun in principle but in the game it is because it is unique. Shenmue is one of the very few games I can think of where you could do something like this. That is the clear difference between this and Call of Duty which lost its charm by not doing much to change. Shenmue still fells like a game.

People remember games that are designed purely to be fun just as much and if not more as games you say are experiences. Mario, Zelda, Pac-Man, Street Fighter and Crash Bandicoot, all examples of games that are still widely loved and have an impression on not only people but society and culture as a whole. Even if these games didn't receive iterations every few years, they would still be just as loved.

The Last of Us as I used for my previous example is essentially a movie with poor game play segments and I argue not a terribly good story either, an argument for characters could be made but that I will not debate. I remember the most simplistic arcade game better than that, I couldn't even complete it.

In the end I guess it is all preference. I don't take personal offense.
User avatar
Mr.Jigen
Funny Bear Burger Clerk
Funny Bear Burger Clerk
 
Joined: December 2017
Location: United States
XBL: Onettown
Nintendo FC: Joeython
Steam: ThatOneGuyWhoPlaysGa
Favorite title: Shenmue
Currently playing: Shenmue

Re: New features.

Postby Shenmue_Legend » Tue Dec 12, 2017 4:42 pm

Mr.Jigen wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
sand4fish wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Mr.Jigen wrote:
I wholeheartedly disagree with you.


Elaborate.


It needs to be fun. So... more gun play, car chases and explosions. Maybe Ryo dual wielding katanas could be an alternative to shooting, just for the sake of keeping the martial arts thematic. And as Shenmue isn't trying to be realistic because of a Sega Saturn in 1986, a smartphone with game apps and GPS pre-installed would be convenient too. That would solve the problem of no arcade games in rural China.


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! I know you're only joking, but I bet Mr. Jigen isn't. His idea of "fun" in Shenmue III probably isn't far off :D But I can't know for sure until he "elaborates"!


You really want this to be like that, not everyone who disagrees with you is automatically stupid.


I never said you were stupid. And yes you're free to disagree with me but you didn't even explain why!


Games are not paintings, they are interactive experiences in my opinion something like Pac-Man would trump something like the telltale Walking Dead series. These are not games they are movies with very basic interaction if I wanted a movie I'd go to the theater.

Shenmue has the aspect of uniqueness, driving a forklift may not be fun in principle but in the game it is because it is unique. Shenmue is one of the very few games I can think of where you could do something like this. That is the clear difference between this and Call of Duty which lost its charm by not doing much to change. Shenmue still fells like a game.

People remember games that are designed purely to be fun just as much and if not more as games you say are experiences. Mario, Zelda, Pac-Man, Street Fighter and Crash Bandicoot, all examples of games that are still widely loved and have an impression on not only people but society and culture as a whole. Even if these games didn't receive iterations every few years, they would still be just as loved.

The Last of Us as I used for my previous example is essentially a movie with poor game play segments and I argue not a terribly good story either, an argument for characters could be made but that I will not debate. I remember the most simplistic arcade game better than that, I couldn't even complete it.

In the end I guess it is all preference. I don't take personal offense.


Well the best games are like works of art. Games like Pac-man and Mario (the 2D side strollers that is, not stuff like 64 or Odyssey!) can't really be considered the best in terms of quality and actual substance. "Fun" is the only thing they have. I mean they're popular and fun, but so is Call Of Duty and that's what I'd compare them to.

The Last Of Us actually has great gameplay! It's very tactical and strategic. It's not your average third person shooter like the Uncharted series so it's very unique in that aspect. In fact, the online multiplayer mode is one of the best out of any game. Simply because the gameplay is well designed and of a high quality. That's why people still play it and that's also why it's highly praised.

And yeah in the end of course, it is all preference. I want experiences that are unique and special and I don't care whether I'm entertained or not in the process. You're more of a traditional gamer and prefer your games to be fun. Nothing wrong with that. Different tastes and aims!
User avatar
Shenmue_Legend
Banned
Banned
 
Joined: August 2017

Previous

Return to Shenmue III

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

Powered by phpBB © 2000-
ShenmueDojo.net