$15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game IMO

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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby sand4fish » Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:16 pm

hoonding wrote: Sony definitely supporting Shenmue 3... they'll invest an amount equal to what was raised through Kickstarter at best.


Where did you get that info? Source please.
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Nahovil » Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:22 pm

sand4fish wrote:
hoonding wrote: Sony definitely supporting Shenmue 3... they'll invest an amount equal to what was raised through Kickstarter at best.


Where did you get that info? Source please.




That makes no sense. They'll put in much more.




Asked if he expects the game’s final budget to be comparable to those of previous Shenmue games, Suzuki said he hopes it will be. Without knowing the amount of investment put in outside of Kickstarter, it’s hard to know how realistic that may be. But as of this writing on the Kickstarter campaign’s second day, it has almost crossed the $3 million mark, so Suzuki may be on his way.



Polygon's interview with Yu Suzuki
Last edited by Nahovil on Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby DaMulder » Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:23 pm

Now it all makes sense! That's why you cannot buy any PS4 hardcopies. Sony will sell those! Although it will be quite hard to sell them in great numbers cause as long as the Kickstarter goes as planned,the game will have sold half a million copies already before it's even made and the Shenmue fanbase isn't THAT big anymore... but then, Sony is going bust in 10 - 15 years anyway.
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby ImGladUmad » Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:31 pm

Nahovil wrote:
sand4fish wrote:
hoonding wrote: Sony definitely supporting Shenmue 3... they'll invest an amount equal to what was raised through Kickstarter at best.


Where did you get that info? Source please.




That makes no sense. They'll put in much more.




Asked if he expects the game’s final budget to be comparable to those of previous Shenmue games, Suzuki said he hopes it will be. Without knowing the amount of investment put in outside of Kickstarter, it’s hard to know how realistic that may be. But as of this writing on the Kickstarter campaign’s second day, it has almost crossed the $3 million mark, so Suzuki may be on his way.



Polygon's interview with Yu Suzuki


How doesn't it make sense? You really think Sony will put much more than half without prove?

I dont understand why you people think this? Sony is a borderline bankrupt company and that quote of Yu Suzuki tells us that he is hoping, which to me sounds like a huge leap of faith hope.

If Sony was backing it so amazingly why does shenmue have such a crap E3 trailer? Not to mention the kickstarter goals are really really low.

Face it, all the evidence is showing that Shenmue 3 is getting minimal help from sony and at best they will match the kickstarter....but even I doubt that.
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby hoonding » Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:31 pm

sand4fish wrote:
hoonding wrote: Sony definitely supporting Shenmue 3... they'll invest an amount equal to what was raised through Kickstarter at best.


Where did you get that info? Source please.

According to translation of Famitsu interview funding comes primarily from Kickstarter

- He noticed that fans were getting more and more despondent about the chances of a Shenmue 3 ever coming out, and being willing to settle for just about any format (novel, manga etc.) just to see the conclusion of the story, but he really wanted to make the sequel as a game even if it didn't have all the bells and whistles he'd like to put in it.
- He first learned about Kickstarter about 3 years ago through a fan who'd used it before, although it took a while before he decided that was really the way to go forward. Tried looking for a major company to partner with, but couldn't find one that met his criteria. Eventually, he decided Kickstarter was the best option.
- Sega readily allowed him to make the game, and SCE gave their support too (nothing specific here).
- It'll be out on PS4 and PC. No mention of other platforms, no mention of considering any other platforms.
- 2 million is the bare minimum for the game to exist, and if that was all they got, it would just be focused on the story. The more money it gets, the more of the things he wants to do will be possible.
- He wants to give the fans what they want as much as possible, asking for their opinions during development and incorporating those into the final game. Like if they have two ideas for a character, they might ask backers to vote on which they prefer.
- As far as money goes, he expects the game's investment will primarily come from individual backers, so he wants them all to be happy with the finished product. Doesn't sound like Sony and others are giving them all THAT much.

- The story will take place in Guilin, beginning immediately after 2's end. You'll be able to go around the town(s) in that area, back to the mountains, infiltrate the Chi You Men's Guilin branch, etc.
- Back when he made Shenmue 2, he was determined that Shenmue 3's focus would be making a deeper open world rather than a bigger one. Fewer characters means they can have more to say, they can have more complex AI, etc. The character Ryo will talk to the most in 3 is Shenhua, so he wants to develop her as much as possible, making it so that talking to her lots makes her behaviour towards him change, makes quests involving her proceed differently, etc.
- Not that any of this is to say it won't be an open world game. Stretch goals will determine how much the town(s) can be expanded (presumably this is referring to stretch goals like those we can already see, the 'other towns' in that video aren't addressed here.)
- QTEs were originally designed so that people who weren't very good at battles could still enjoy the game.
- He wants to make 'free battles' (which are likely to have their name changed) less about pressing buttons at the right time and more about making the right decisions.
- He also wants to make them less about practising and inputting commands and more centred around the Technique Scrolls, so obtaining and using those is enough to win battles. These Technique Scrolls will ideally connect a number of different elements in the game together in a natural way.
"Shenmue had a number of minigames, gambling spots etc. that you could spend time playing around in, but I wanted something that would connect all of them somehow. I mean, obviously you can obtain money through part-time jobs, use that in gambling to get more of it and then buy weapons...but not that kind of connection, a closer one. If we can meet a number of our stretch goals and make the open world elements more elaborate, I'm hoping to be able to connect these side elements together, centred around the scrolls.
- He's desperately trying to find some way to include forklifts in the game in a way that will make sense, because Shenmue fans seem to love them.
- He wanted to gather as many of the people who worked on the earlier games as possible because it'd be reassuring to fans. They're planning to publish staff comments from a number of figures working on the game, including the writer Masahiro Yoshimoto.
- He's asked about whether he has an idea in his head about what'll come after Shenmue 3's done (presumably 4, but it doesn't come out and say this). He says he does, but right now he's focused on working on Shenmue 3. Certainly doesn't sound like this game will be 'it' at any rate.
- As the Kickstarter page says, he's hoping the game will be ready to release at the end of 2017.


(from NeoGAF)

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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby ImGladUmad » Thu Jun 18, 2015 5:48 pm

hoonding wrote:
sand4fish wrote:
hoonding wrote: Sony definitely supporting Shenmue 3... they'll invest an amount equal to what was raised through Kickstarter at best.


Where did you get that info? Source please.

According to translation of Famitsu interview funding comes primarily from Kickstarter

- He noticed that fans were getting more and more despondent about the chances of a Shenmue 3 ever coming out, and being willing to settle for just about any format (novel, manga etc.) just to see the conclusion of the story, but he really wanted to make the sequel as a game even if it didn't have all the bells and whistles he'd like to put in it.
- He first learned about Kickstarter about 3 years ago through a fan who'd used it before, although it took a while before he decided that was really the way to go forward. Tried looking for a major company to partner with, but couldn't find one that met his criteria. Eventually, he decided Kickstarter was the best option.
- Sega readily allowed him to make the game, and SCE gave their support too (nothing specific here).
- It'll be out on PS4 and PC. No mention of other platforms, no mention of considering any other platforms.
- 2 million is the bare minimum for the game to exist, and if that was all they got, it would just be focused on the story. The more money it gets, the more of the things he wants to do will be possible.
- He wants to give the fans what they want as much as possible, asking for their opinions during development and incorporating those into the final game. Like if they have two ideas for a character, they might ask backers to vote on which they prefer.
- As far as money goes, he expects the game's investment will primarily come from individual backers, so he wants them all to be happy with the finished product. Doesn't sound like Sony and others are giving them all THAT much.

- The story will take place in Guilin, beginning immediately after 2's end. You'll be able to go around the town(s) in that area, back to the mountains, infiltrate the Chi You Men's Guilin branch, etc.
- Back when he made Shenmue 2, he was determined that Shenmue 3's focus would be making a deeper open world rather than a bigger one. Fewer characters means they can have more to say, they can have more complex AI, etc. The character Ryo will talk to the most in 3 is Shenhua, so he wants to develop her as much as possible, making it so that talking to her lots makes her behaviour towards him change, makes quests involving her proceed differently, etc.
- Not that any of this is to say it won't be an open world game. Stretch goals will determine how much the town(s) can be expanded (presumably this is referring to stretch goals like those we can already see, the 'other towns' in that video aren't addressed here.)
- QTEs were originally designed so that people who weren't very good at battles could still enjoy the game.
- He wants to make 'free battles' (which are likely to have their name changed) less about pressing buttons at the right time and more about making the right decisions.
- He also wants to make them less about practising and inputting commands and more centred around the Technique Scrolls, so obtaining and using those is enough to win battles. These Technique Scrolls will ideally connect a number of different elements in the game together in a natural way.
"Shenmue had a number of minigames, gambling spots etc. that you could spend time playing around in, but I wanted something that would connect all of them somehow. I mean, obviously you can obtain money through part-time jobs, use that in gambling to get more of it and then buy weapons...but not that kind of connection, a closer one. If we can meet a number of our stretch goals and make the open world elements more elaborate, I'm hoping to be able to connect these side elements together, centred around the scrolls.
- He's desperately trying to find some way to include forklifts in the game in a way that will make sense, because Shenmue fans seem to love them.
- He wanted to gather as many of the people who worked on the earlier games as possible because it'd be reassuring to fans. They're planning to publish staff comments from a number of figures working on the game, including the writer Masahiro Yoshimoto.
- He's asked about whether he has an idea in his head about what'll come after Shenmue 3's done (presumably 4, but it doesn't come out and say this). He says he does, but right now he's focused on working on Shenmue 3. Certainly doesn't sound like this game will be 'it' at any rate.
- As the Kickstarter page says, he's hoping the game will be ready to release at the end of 2017.


(from NeoGAF)


Thanks good interview.

This proves my point, Yu Suzuki just wants to finish the story and is will to sacrifice a lot to do so...I know he says a more intimate story without much openness but Shenmue must have openess, it must have all those perks he mentions in this article and in the kickstarter goals.

Also unless he is lying, then Kickstarter is the primary source...Which make sense but some people still believe SONY is backing it up hardcore lol.
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Master Kyodai » Thu Jun 18, 2015 6:12 pm

15 million... I think that would have been highly unrealistic. The worlds most funded project ever was the Pebble time watch - around 20 million. But there you got a piece of hardware which was pretty much like the apple watch - just long before that - for 159 Dollars. And their funding goal was 500,000 Dollars. The highest goal ever - from waht i remember - was 2 million dollar for the veronica Mars movie.

2 million on kickstarter is already a lot - especially for a game. keep in mind that it has nearly zero production cost - so like 98% goes directly to development. For something like the pebble watch - even if you can produce it for like 80 bucks per piece in big quantities you already lose half of the money on production cost.

For a video game Shenmue is performing beyong all expectations already. keep in mind - it's 29 Dollars for the game, so even if a hundred thousand people would have spent that we would not have reached the 3 million yet.

that we reached like 3.2 million US from just 41,000 backers is already really a lot. For a game that hasn't even started development yet (the normal Joe can't even tell it's great yet) and for a game that is not released on Xbox, Mac OSX, Wii U or Linux at all.

15 million is just - a dreamers thing. highly unrealistic. We wanted Shenmue 3, not a crushed dream of Shenmue 3. So the way it's working out right now was perfect. That the kickstarter campaign has already broken many records on kickstarter is highly encouraging. Other games like Wasteland 2 got less money in a month then what Shenmue 3 got in 3 days and they made a wonderful game with a gigantic world, great voices, awesome quests, characters and stories and they did NOT have Yu Suzuki on board. So i got no doubts that Shenmue 3 will be great. maybe we won't get seperate footstep sound for every character, no horoscope and biography for every NPC, but honestly - who remembers the blood type of the tobacco lady from Shenmue 1 or how different Ine sans steps in the kitchen sounded from Ryos? We also don't need to make an engine from scratch that drives a brand new unknown console to its limits or awesome compression and file managemtn strategies for new media (GD-ROM). I think Yu will deliver a GREAT game with awesome graphics and the story we waited for. if we break the world record of funding for a video game on Kickstarter i think we can already be VERY happy. And at the moment it seems we are exactly on this way.

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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Himuro » Thu Jun 18, 2015 6:12 pm

ImGladUmad wrote:
This proves my point, Yu Suzuki just wants to finish the story and is will to sacrifice a lot to do so...I know he says a more intimate story without much openness but Shenmue must have openess, it must have all those perks he mentions in this article and in the kickstarter goals.


You are misinterpreting this. Like I said, it sounds like it wants it scaled down to Shenmue 1. He hasn't said anything about it not being open, and Shenmue 1 isn't really that open compared to say, 2, anyways.
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Nahovil » Thu Jun 18, 2015 6:19 pm

ImGladUmad wrote:How doesn't it make sense? You really think Sony will put much more than half without prove?

I dont understand why you people think this? Sony is a borderline bankrupt company and that quote of Yu Suzuki tells us that he is hoping, which to me sounds like a huge leap of faith hope.

If Sony was backing it so amazingly why does shenmue have such a crap E3 trailer? Not to mention the kickstarter goals are really really low.

Face it, all the evidence is showing that Shenmue 3 is getting minimal help from sony and at best they will match the kickstarter....but even I doubt that.






The proof? 2 million dollars gathered in 8 hours.
The trailer is an independently made pitch which, unlike the rest of the games being shown on E3, although underwhelming, simply represents bad marketing. No trailer should have been shown if there was nothing worth showing, as announcing the production would've sufficed - If anything it tells us how Yu Suzuki wanted to give the fans something.



There's no evidence of that. The main point is, we don't know what investment is being put in, and thus it makes no sense saying it won't be enough.
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Sonoshee » Thu Jun 18, 2015 6:22 pm

A $3000 tier was just added for a replica Ryo Hazuki jacket! \:D/
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Locke_cole » Thu Jun 18, 2015 6:27 pm

Sonoshee wrote: A $3000 tier was just added for a replica Ryo Hazuki jacket! \:D/


Hey atleast they are still adding stuff
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby mrandyk » Thu Jun 18, 2015 7:17 pm

$15 million is a pipe dream and not remotely necessary. Sony will back this project considerably if the fans are able to make it one of the most successful Kickstarters ever since they stand to make a lot of money from disc sales when this finally hits shelves. That fans have put this into the top 20 most successful Kickstarters in less than 72 hours is remarkable. Sony would be wasting an opportunity if they did not capitalize on this, and I don't think they are about to let it slip by if they put it in their E3 presentation.
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Luke_09 » Thu Jun 18, 2015 7:26 pm

The fact of the matter is, NO ONE other than Yu Suzuki himself knows exactly how much extra funding he is getting! Until he tells us for sure, everything else is just speculation. That is why we MUST continue to promote and push this KickStarter so that it gets as much funding as it possibly can get!

The more KickStarter funding it gets, the more that investors will be willing to part with their cash as it's less of a risk for them, it really is as simple as that!
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Kevo » Thu Jun 18, 2015 7:51 pm

Interesting article on the costs of other large video games:

http://kotaku.com/how-much-does-it-cost ... 1501413649
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Re: $15million or bust Kickstarter instead of waterdown game

Postby Luke_09 » Thu Jun 18, 2015 8:07 pm

Kevo wrote: Interesting article on the costs of other large video games:

http://kotaku.com/how-much-does-it-cost ... 1501413649


That is a VERY interesting article indeed! Gears of War cost $10 million and that was an amazing game, both from the point of view of: graphics, gameplay, story, cut-scenes, voice acting.

To me, that article is quite reassuring that great games can be made with a relatively modest budget!

...And not the $30-50 million that some people have been saying!
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