Ryo's clothes look too tight

(Chapter 7 and beyond)

Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Spaghetti » Tue Mar 21, 2017 6:27 pm

Rikitatsu wrote: Literally nothing about this Ryo model looks right to me, from his body shape, clothing, hair, butt... So I really hope this is just a placeholder from E3'15 and a completely different model than the one being worked on for the final game.

It's a new model. 100% sure of this judging by just how many easily identifiable changes there are.

It's obviously not finished yet, mind you, and probably just the latest version they had on-hand when they did their last bulk import of art assets which could have been months ago.

I made a brief catalogue of identifiable changes/improvements in the update thread: http://www.shenmuedojo.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=50660&start=195

- but if you think nothing about the model looks right then you're probably not going to care.

I have to wonder what you expect to eventually see if you think nothing about this new model looks right.
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Rikitatsu » Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:02 pm

Spaghetti wrote:
Rikitatsu wrote: Literally nothing about this Ryo model looks right to me, from his body shape, clothing, hair, butt... So I really hope this is just a placeholder from E3'15 and a completely different model than the one being worked on for the final game.

It's a new model. 100% sure of this judging by just how many easily identifiable changes there are.

It's obviously not finished yet, mind you, and probably just the latest version they had on-hand when they did their last bulk import of art assets which could have been months ago.

I made a brief catalogue of identifiable changes/improvements in the update thread: http://www.shenmuedojo.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=50660&start=195

- but if you think nothing about the model looks right then you're probably not going to care.

Frankly, I can barely see any differences aside from the hair, it's especially hard to tell when the lighting conditions are drastically different between the screenshots, maybe they did some tweaks to the materials, but that's it. Otherwise it looks the same. You mention his legs aren't like twigs anymore, well, they still look the same to me:

Image
Image

I have to wonder what you expect to eventually see if you think nothing about this new model looks right.

Let's see:

- Broader torso and shoulders
- Thicker legs
- Clothes that are more loose
- Proper placement of the Tiger's design (It's a bit too high up on his jacket)
- Hair that is more faithful to his original design
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Spaghetti » Tue Mar 21, 2017 8:13 pm

Rikitatsu wrote:Frankly, I can barely see any differences aside from the hair, it's especially hard to tell when the lighting conditions are drastically different between the screenshots, maybe they did some tweaks to the materials, but that's it. Otherwise it looks the same.

Really? Some of the changes are very obvious IMO, regardless of differences in lighting conditions.

I don't think there was a single screenshot in any lighting conditions of the E3 2015 model that didn't have the light reflect off the jacket, and in the most recent backer video the jacket - despite having light sources on it - is not displaying reflections like it was covered in olive oil. So there's clearly been work done and adjustments to how that material reacts to light.

Rikitatsu wrote:You mention his legs aren't like twigs anymore, well, they still look the same to me:

Image
Image

Image
Image
Image

Looks thicker to me, tbh. The only major problem I see is that Ryo has no ass so his legs just merge into this weird void. They do look kinda slender in the same shot we took of Ryo during gameplay (although yours has some camera blur and make them look narrower than they actually are), but from other angles Ryo's legs look thicker, while E3 2015 Ryo's legs are straight up drainpipes from every angle in the reveal trailer.

They could do with taking a little bit of the length off the jeans/legs overall as well as fixing his ass, but that's just me.

Rikitatsu wrote:Let's see:

- Broader torso and shoulders
- Thicker legs
- Clothes that are more loose
- Proper placement of the Tiger's design (It's a bit too high up on his jacket)
- Hair that is more faithful to his original design

- Broader torso and shoulders (Really? Ryo's width seems fine already, he just looks less blocky compared to his Dreamcast counterpart)

See: Image

- Thicker legs (As far as I can tell we've got them.)

- Clothes that are more loose (See: new jeans. See: recent update video. The jacket doesn't cling to his middle/lower back like he's been vacuum sealed into it, like the E3 2015 model)

- Proper placement of the Tiger's design (Yep, looks like one of the flag patches on his arm is missing too, but that's easily added/fixed)

- Hair that is more faithful to his original design (It's already better than the E3 2015 model in that the highlights aren't fucked up and it looks more like actual hair, but they've still got a ways to go on the shape/layers to convey that textured spiky depth. They're at least halfway towards it looking better as a whole.)

I just don't really see how there's nothing to like about the changes when on a technical and aesthetic level we've leaped ahead of the E3 2015 model in lots of ways.
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Rikitatsu » Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:02 pm

Almost all of the screenshots released previously of Ryo had been under a strong light (like the Sun), while here Ryo is in a dimly lit shack, it wouldn't be wise to draw conclusions about how reflective his jacket is unless we get a screenshot in similar light conditions.

At least we agree that Ryo's ass is not satisfactory.
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Peter » Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:34 pm

It also wouldn't be wise to draw conclusions on the rightness or wrongness of a small part of a videogame that would be barely at 50% completion at best.

But c'est la vie.
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Spaghetti » Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:41 pm

Rikitatsu wrote: Almost all of the screenshots released previously of Ryo had been under a strong light (like the Sun), while here Ryo is in a dimly lit shack, it wouldn't be wise to draw conclusions about how reflective his jacket is unless we get a screenshot in similar light conditions.

Naw, c'mon. There are strong light sources nearby which is why there's a very clear definition between light and dark on the jacket, the jeans, and the hair, whereas the E3 2015 model would shine when *any* lighting source was applied to it, like the interior testing shots from the October 2015 update.

Peter wrote: It also wouldn't be wise to draw conclusions on the rightness or wrongness of a small part of a videogame that would be barely at 50% completion at best.

But c'est la vie.

Also this. :lol:

My second favourite Dojo hobby is bickering about shit that doesn't matter to kill time.
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Rikitatsu » Tue Mar 21, 2017 9:59 pm

Spaghetti wrote:
Rikitatsu wrote: Almost all of the screenshots released previously of Ryo had been under a strong light (like the Sun), while here Ryo is in a dimly lit shack, it wouldn't be wise to draw conclusions about how reflective his jacket is unless we get a screenshot in similar light conditions.

Naw, c'mon. There are strong light sources nearby which is why there's a very clear definition between light and dark on the jacket, the jeans, and the hair, whereas the E3 2015 model would shine when *any* lighting source was applied to it, like the interior testing shots from the October 2015 update.

Peter wrote: It also wouldn't be wise to draw conclusions on the rightness or wrongness of a small part of a videogame that would be barely at 50% completion at best.

But c'est la vie.

Also this. :lol:

My second favourite Dojo hobby is bickering about shit that doesn't matter to kill time.


I'm on PS4 so I can't link it, but remember the prototype battle shot where Ryo is facing a black suit outdoors? You'll notice that his jacket isn't reflective in that shot due to the light conditions and maybe angle.

Also, Peter, your post doesn't make sense in the context of the conversation, everyone here recognizes that Ryo's model is being worked on and unfinished, that doesn't mean we shouldn't discuss what we dislike about it and what changes/tweaks do we want in the final model
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Spaghetti » Tue Mar 21, 2017 10:18 pm

Rikitatsu wrote:I'm on PS4 so I can't link it, but remember the prototype battle shot where Ryo is facing a black suit outdoors? You'll notice that his jacket isn't reflective in that shot due to the light conditions and maybe angle.

I was talking about that exact update, although a different screenshot.

You might want to look at that screen again closely, because I'm seeing reflections on the jacket from the collar down.
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Rikitatsu » Tue Mar 21, 2017 11:27 pm

Spaghetti wrote:
Rikitatsu wrote:I'm on PS4 so I can't link it, but remember the prototype battle shot where Ryo is facing a black suit outdoors? You'll notice that his jacket isn't reflective in that shot due to the light conditions and maybe angle.

I was talking about that exact update, although a different screenshot.

You might want to look at that screen again closely, because I'm seeing reflections on the jacket from the collar down.

I do see some reflections upon zooming in, yeah.
It would be great if they did away with the reflective jacket, but I'll wait until we see more shots in different light conditions and angles to be sure. That said, the reflectiveness or lack thereof has more to do with the materials than the actual model itself, which still doesn't look noticeably different to me, I know you pointed stuff that you think have changed, but I just don't see it.

And to me, that is a great sign. It means they're not building upon on this model, but actually making a new one from scratch.
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby shredingskin » Wed Mar 22, 2017 3:26 am

Rikitatsu wrote:
Spaghetti wrote:
I have to wonder what you expect to eventually see if you think nothing about this new model looks right.

Let's see:

- Broader torso and shoulders
- Thicker legs
- Clothes that are more loose
- Proper placement of the Tiger's design (It's a bit too high up on his jacket)
- Hair that is more faithful to his original design
- His ass not being raped by jeans.


Fixt

Overall I think it looks fucking OK. Clipping is going to happen from time to time.
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Re: Ryo's clothes look too tight

Postby Himuro » Wed Mar 22, 2017 10:35 am

Can we all please cherish this moment? We are debating Ryo's model for SHENMUE III. I still can't believe it.
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