Shenmue Dojo

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:45 am**

well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:25 am**

As with all worries, it all goes back to having faith in Ys Net.

Many in the development team made Shenmue what it was.

And they can make Shenmue III what it needs to be now.

We can give our outside opinions, but they call the final shots.

The faith we had in saving Shenmue III is the same faith we'll need now seeing it made.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2017 10:58 am**

Spardahunter wrote: well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

Sounds like you just sucked at it. Anyway, what do you mean by "today's standards"? If we're talking about quality, then today's games aren't anything amazing. There aren't any action-adventure type games that have better combat than the Shenmue series and even if there are, Shenmue is certainly one of the best in this aspect. So yeah, I don't get the "isn't aged well" thing you said. It couldn't be further from the truth!

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:01 pm**

I'm yet to see a game replicate the 70 men battle.

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:41 pm**

Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Spardahunter wrote: well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

Sounds like you just sucked at it. Anyway, what do you mean by "today's standards"? If we're talking about quality, then today's games aren't anything amazing. There aren't any action-adventure type games that have better combat than the Shenmue series and even if there are, Shenmue is certainly one of the best in this aspect. So yeah, I don't get the "isn't aged well" thing you said. It couldn't be further from the truth!

i don't want to offend anyone,i like the shenmue combat system,i like complex fightning game(always preferred street fighter rather than virtua fighte).In my opinion is a little weird for today,it needs a little tweak to collision,camera and group fight,not simplified but sharpened

Posted: **Wed Sep 06, 2017 4:42 pm**

I liked the combat system in Shenmue too, but it wasn't perfect then and time certainly hasn't been too kind to it. I don't care for simplification either, but rather refinement.

Posted: **Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:09 am**

Spardahunter wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Spardahunter wrote: well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

Sounds like you just sucked at it. Anyway, what do you mean by "today's standards"? If we're talking about quality, then today's games aren't anything amazing. There aren't any action-adventure type games that have better combat than the Shenmue series and even if there are, Shenmue is certainly one of the best in this aspect. So yeah, I don't get the "isn't aged well" thing you said. It couldn't be further from the truth!

i don't want to offend anyone,i like the shenmue combat system,i like complex fightning game(always preferred street fighter rather than virtua fighte).In my opinion is a little weird for today,it needs a little tweak to collision,camera and group fight,not simplified but sharpened

You say that you like complex fighting games and yet you prefer Street Fighter over Virtua Fighter? You kinda contradicted yourself there because Virtua Fighter is alot more complex and deeper than Street Fighter. That's a well known fact. Also, I don't see any adventure game like Shenmue that has a better combat system. The main ones known today are Sleeping Dogs, the Batman Arkham series and Yakuza. I think Shenmue definitely has a much better combat system than either of those. Of course I'm not saying it's perfect (it could be made into a more complex, deeper and technical system for example) but it's certainly one of the best ever out of any game. So how could something that is not only one of the best but is also better than modern games not have "aged well"?

Posted: **Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:26 am**

Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Spardahunter wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Spardahunter wrote: well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

Sounds like you just sucked at it. Anyway, what do you mean by "today's standards"? If we're talking about quality, then today's games aren't anything amazing. There aren't any action-adventure type games that have better combat than the Shenmue series and even if there are, Shenmue is certainly one of the best in this aspect. So yeah, I don't get the "isn't aged well" thing you said. It couldn't be further from the truth!

i don't want to offend anyone,i like the shenmue combat system,i like complex fightning game(always preferred street fighter rather than virtua fighte).In my opinion is a little weird for today,it needs a little tweak to collision,camera and group fight,not simplified but sharpened

You say that you like complex fighting games and yet you prefer Street Fighter over Virtua Fighter? You kinda contradicted yourself there because Virtua Fighter is alot more complex and deeper than Street Fighter. That's a well known fact. Also, I don't see any adventure game like Shenmue that has a better combat system. The main ones known today are Sleeping Dogs, the Batman Arkham series and Yakuza. I think Shenmue definitely has a much better combat system than either of those. Of course I'm not saying it's perfect (it could be made into a more complex, deeper and technical system for example) but it's certainly one of the best ever out of any game. So how could something that is not only one of the best but is also better than modern games not have "aged well"?

do you follow FGC??? i like sf and vf but street fighter is harder,have you ever played 3rd strike?1 frame link combo,frame perfect parry ecc,3d fightning game have a lot of fifty fifty situation(that is bad for a competitive fightning game).But let's close this debate,we are going off track

Posted: **Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:23 am**

killthesagabeforeitkillsu wrote: I'm yet to see a game replicate the 70 men battle.

Not a fighting game (but neither is Shenmue strictly) Kingdom Hearts 2 has you battle 1000 enemies at once.

Posted: **Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:29 am**

Spardahunter wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Spardahunter wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Spardahunter wrote: well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

Sounds like you just sucked at it. Anyway, what do you mean by "today's standards"? If we're talking about quality, then today's games aren't anything amazing. There aren't any action-adventure type games that have better combat than the Shenmue series and even if there are, Shenmue is certainly one of the best in this aspect. So yeah, I don't get the "isn't aged well" thing you said. It couldn't be further from the truth!

i don't want to offend anyone,i like the shenmue combat system,i like complex fightning game(always preferred street fighter rather than virtua fighte).In my opinion is a little weird for today,it needs a little tweak to collision,camera and group fight,not simplified but sharpened

You say that you like complex fighting games and yet you prefer Street Fighter over Virtua Fighter? You kinda contradicted yourself there because Virtua Fighter is alot more complex and deeper than Street Fighter. That's a well known fact. Also, I don't see any adventure game like Shenmue that has a better combat system. The main ones known today are Sleeping Dogs, the Batman Arkham series and Yakuza. I think Shenmue definitely has a much better combat system than either of those. Of course I'm not saying it's perfect (it could be made into a more complex, deeper and technical system for example) but it's certainly one of the best ever out of any game. So how could something that is not only one of the best but is also better than modern games not have "aged well"?

do you follow FGC??? i like sf and vf but street fighter is harder,have you ever played 3rd strike?1 frame link combo,frame perfect parry ecc,3d fightning game have a lot of fifty fifty situation(that is bad for a competitive fightning game).But let's close this debate,we are going off track

Yes, I've played 3rd strike. I play it quite frequently in fact. However, I still think Virtua Fighter is more complex and harder to get good at. But anyway I agree, let's get back on topic!

Posted: **Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:41 am**

jasonorme666 wrote: I think the old fighting system would age Shenmue 3 terribly.
I'd welcome a new system, look at the Batman Arkham games, the way you chain, block and counter attack is stunning to watch and flows beautifully.
It would be perfect for a martial arts themed game.

oh god no, arkham is terrible. shenmue was amazing because it took effort to learn ryo's every move. that should stay in this game as well.

Posted: **Fri Sep 08, 2017 3:00 am**

Spardahunter wrote: well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5xleq2HgDY[/youtube]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxlPwI400wA[/youtube]

if you were good at the game, it featured none of what you mentioned and fighting with multiple opponents you needed to use throws and isolate single opponents there. I never had a problem

Posted: **Fri Sep 08, 2017 3:16 am**

drunkensailor wrote:
Spardahunter wrote: well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5xleq2HgDY[/youtube]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxlPwI400wA[/youtube]

if you were good at the game, it featured none of what you mentioned and fighting with multiple opponents you needed to use throws and isolate single opponents there. I never had a problem

well it obviously have some problem,even in the walkthrough of peter and other of them on youtube you see weird camera angles,sometime in group battle ryo doesnt target the enemy you want(or worse he doesn't turn and he get stabbed in the back),and the fps fight in shenmue 2?i don't want a complete overhaul in favour of a shitty system like batman,i want some fixes

Posted: **Sat Sep 16, 2017 12:38 pm**

strider16 wrote: All this can be easily solved. When ("if", more realistic) vf6 enters development, it would probably use ue4.

Tekken has stomped it out. It's had the market for too long unchallenged. Everybody that used to play VF is either old & doesn't play games anymore or switched to playing Tekken. I don't think there's enough in it for Sega to ever bring it back at this point. Maybe when people get tired of Tekken, but that appears to be no time soon.

Posted: **Sat Sep 16, 2017 1:13 pm**

Spardahunter wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Spardahunter wrote:
Shenmue_Legend wrote:
Spardahunter wrote: well,old shenmue combat system isn't aged well,strange collision,fucked camera,fight in first person(during shenmue2)and problem with multiple enemy at time.That combat can appeal only diehard fan,for today standard is shit,but shenmue 3 must use the batman system?no thanks

Sounds like you just sucked at it. Anyway, what do you mean by "today's standards"? If we're talking about quality, then today's games aren't anything amazing. There aren't any action-adventure type games that have better combat than the Shenmue series and even if there are, Shenmue is certainly one of the best in this aspect. So yeah, I don't get the "isn't aged well" thing you said. It couldn't be further from the truth!

i don't want to offend anyone,i like the shenmue combat system,i like complex fightning game(always preferred street fighter rather than virtua fighte).In my opinion is a little weird for today,it needs a little tweak to collision,camera and group fight,not simplified but sharpened

You say that you like complex fighting games and yet you prefer Street Fighter over Virtua Fighter? You kinda contradicted yourself there because Virtua Fighter is alot more complex and deeper than Street Fighter. That's a well known fact. Also, I don't see any adventure game like Shenmue that has a better combat system. The main ones known today are Sleeping Dogs, the Batman Arkham series and Yakuza. I think Shenmue definitely has a much better combat system than either of those. Of course I'm not saying it's perfect (it could be made into a more complex, deeper and technical system for example) but it's certainly one of the best ever out of any game. So how could something that is not only one of the best but is also better than modern games not have "aged well"?

do you follow FGC??? i like sf and vf but street fighter is harder,have you ever played 3rd strike?1 frame link combo,frame perfect parry ecc,3d fightning game have a lot of fifty fifty situation(that is bad for a competitive fightning game).But let's close this debate,we are going off track

VF has all that, and way more options available at a given moment than any other fighting game. So when considering your strategies to beat your opponent, there are way more scenarios to consider at any given moment. And because of that, VF becomes less about solely exploiting your character's given abilities to force a win out of them (the part I dislike about SF4 and Marvel), and more about manipulating your opponent into logical traps.

Now for example, take okizeme. You can blast me if I'm wrong, but in SF3, when attempting oki, you have to consider whether the knocked-down opponent will quick-rise or not and whether or not they will reversal you (if they even have a reversal). In VF5FS, when attempting oki, the first thing to consider is whether or not your opponent will tech. And if they do tech, what direction will they tech (teching in place (i.e. quickrise) will force them to stand up, which is weak to throws, and side tech forces them to get up crouching, which can be blown up by launching mids)? If your opponent DOESNT tech, they now have access to back roll. They also have access to wake-up kicks, which are univeral oki reversals, and are also 50-50s (mid or low). They are -6(safe) on block, unless they risk doing a backroll wakeup kick for added space, which is -15 (>kick-class punishable). They are very viable reversals, but they also can be blown up in a variety of ways (some characters also have better options to specifically blow up wakeup kick than others). But then again, your opponent can also NOT tech and NOT use wake up kicks, so that's another thing to think about.

From the above example in VF5FS, just from a knockdown you are now presented with nearly a dozen options to think about, and you have less than a second to respond (high lvl VF is as fast as Marvel btw). The ways that you can respond are even more numerous, and all have different levels of risks/rewards. In order to respond correctly, you have to deduce your opponent's habits, and as fast as VF is, your observation skills have to be on point to be able to respond correctly on multiple occasions in one game. And to win, you have to manipulate your opponent by cutting off certain options of theirs into a predictable set that you can exploit (example: attacking aggressively on a defensive opponent to make them susceptible to a throw, which is what guard is weak to in VF.). The number and level of options available to a player at a given moment is largely determined by frame adv/disadv, which is why frames are so important in VF.

VF is a whole other animal compared to 3rd strike. And 3rd strike was the most technical of any SF game.

Shenmue Dojo

"Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

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Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."

Re: "Unlike Shenmue II it won't use the Virtua engine."