There Is No Reason For Panic (Yet)

(Chapter 7 and beyond)

Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby Shenhua-Nani? » Wed Jun 24, 2015 2:41 pm

Im not that confident in new reward tiers to be honest.

Sure, they will help in squeezing every last bit of money from Shenmue fans, and that's better than nothing, but the real key to a huge success here is getting pledges from people that don't know wtf Shenmue is.

And im not sure how that can be done with a lucklaster page, no easy way to play the prequels, no Xbox, no physical ps4 offer, and uninspiring stretch goals.

Thats the reasoning of a greedy bastard that wants to reach as many stretch goals as possible.

If i have to reason as a fan that had lost all hope until 10 days ago, im extremely happy of the noise we made and money we raised. If we got this far it's because people in this community would give their left hand for a proper Shenmue 3 game.

But at the moment i aim for the sky that we probably won't reach (thanks to incompetent management), lets just hope they leave paypal open for a year so we can continue carrying this franchise out of its grave.
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby shredingskin » Wed Jun 24, 2015 2:51 pm

One thing is constructive criticism and it should be fine. Most people here want to make the best kickstarter possible and for it to get more attention.

They also should start giving new gamers some incentive, a new kickstarter video (or the one here9 would be a good firt step.
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby killthesagabeforeitkillsu » Wed Jun 24, 2015 3:01 pm

It has already been stated countless times, that if you want the "prequels" remastered you need to contact SEGA since Yu Suzuki doesn't own the first two games. Its also ridiculous to expect a small team to make a remaster on top of Shenmue III.
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby MiTT3NZ » Wed Jun 24, 2015 3:33 pm

mrandyk wrote: I'm going to agree with whoever said you are more interested in finding something to bitch about. Negativity isn't necessarily unwarranted, but be constructive about it.


Alright then, if you want me to assume the mantle of Captain Obvious...

- YSNet should've spent more time on creating a short demo, not just Shenhua's poor attempt at a Blue Steel and jumping over a stream. Also, setting it in the cave would've been a bit more poignant. Give non-Shenmue fans a reason to pledge their hard-earned money, don't just expect them to.

- To build on the previous point, the Kickstarter has done as well as it has solely based on the fact that it's Shenmue III. Finally. If Half-Life 3 or Timesplitters 3 also had to take to the site, then they also would've had non-fans donate money. It's an event, a milestone in gaming.

- Shenmue III was a big announcement, and it reached almost everyone who's into video games enough to know what E3 is. Awesome Japan should've realised this, and made plans to maintain momentum. The third will obviously lead to a temporary spike, and historical data points to the probability that it'll also see a big increase in the last few days, but they seem to be overly reliant on this.

- One of the ways they could've done this was through a meta game. Don't expect fans to do the work for you. They should've approached it in a way that sees the fans constantly struggling to decide how much more they should pledge by adding a new tier or two every three to five days. Now, that may be the case of course, but their focus really needs to be on none-fans.

- It's great that they're trying to engage with the fans through polls, the Reddit AMA, etc., but why the hell are they not hammering out interviews with large media sites left, right and centre? They're already guaranteed our money, stop using us as a damn crutch, get out there and do some bleedin work!

- I understand Suzuki setting the initial total at $2m. It's great that he said "no, I want them to have Shenmue III even if it's just a short game", but this should've been made clear from the very beginning. You had the stage at E3 ffs. Sony's stage. You had the biggest audience of next gen console gamers right in front of you. You should've bleedin said something!

- The transparency issue. Almost everyone who knows of Shenmue knows about the whole fiasco behind the budget. This should've been addressed in the Kickstarter video. "We were given a huge budget to develop this game, as we had to create technology that didn't exist, we made it extremely detailed, individual footstep sounds, 3D scanners, meteorological data, it was split into two games, shit was more expensive back then, etc." Drive that point home, compare to how things have changed. Explain that Sony has advertising handled, so 100% of the Kickstarter funds make up the entirety of the game's actual production budget.

- Simplified stretch goals. Why give the subtitles individual tiers? Just say "$3.5m gets all this", "$5m gets all that". The big leaps looks better value for money because of the sheer amount of content packed into each one.

- Replica jackets and mirrors should've definitely been in there from the start. Oh, you want both a Dragon and a Phoenix Mirror? Here's a new reward tier for that!

- For all the years Suzuki has had to design this game in his spare time (which apparently he has), he seems awfully unsure about a lot of things. This says to me that it's still in pre-production. He should've come into this with a very clear view on what he wants to include, and more importantly, how to implement it. Any other bells and whistles can be voted on by the backers, sure, but the core elements of the game? C'mon san.

- Shenmue is an Eastern franchise. It's very Japanese. Whatever. That doesn't mean that you market it to a Western audience via an Eastern-based promotional company. The decision to do this is a massive oversight and terribly naïve.

- Little to no presence. They appear on Kickstarter's most popular. Yu Suzuki and Shenmue III are on Twitter. The game has a website. These are all the places they're expected to be, and that's good, but why the hell haven't they branched out? Okay, sure, this one's a little tricky, but there should have been agreements made with both Sony and SEGA to throw in a little bit more of an extra presence. Facebook ads, banner ads, cross-promotion, etc. Right now it seems like only the fans, Corsi and Boyes are the only ones who give a shit.

- The blatant potential of bad publicity... that was fulfilled. How the hell did they not see any of this coming? Kickstarter as a platform's been under a lot of scrutiny since before the campaign was launched. Why was nothing done to subvert this? Where were the contingency plans? The PR team's fucking useless.

- Not sure if this one's true, but did Suzuki just do one after the first day? This is E3 pal. Drop the mic, sure, but don't just fuck off straight away.

- Less of the corporate responses. Every reply to fan questions so far say nothing. Either answer properly or don't fucking answer at all.



There's plenty more, but I need to eat. The concerns that everyone has are justified. Just because they don't go into great detail (none of which is needed btw, as I say, it's all pretty blatant and self-explanatory) doesn't make them irrelevant or "negative for the sake of being negative."

To counter-balance that though, here are the positives:

- We're getting Shenmue III.
- Sony's handling advertising expenses.
- The leather jackets.
- Yu Suzuki's handling it.
- SEGA are allowing it to happen.

Do I need to explain any of that? Or is it automatically accepted on account of it being the "positives"?
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby ElephantStone » Wed Jun 24, 2015 3:34 pm

Pointing out the fact that the kickstarter has been horribly run by an utterly incompetent company is not "being negative," it's stating a fact.

It's frustrating as fuck because as Henry pointed out, it puts the burden solely on us to raise an insane amount of money, which just isn't possible. Telling yourself everything is fine and then patting yourself on the back for "being positive" isn't doing anything to help, at all. At least the people being critical are actually telling Awesome Japan how to improve things.

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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby MiTT3NZ » Wed Jun 24, 2015 3:43 pm

Mystere wrote:
MiTT3NZ wrote: We're only at that figure because it's been poorly handled. I feel that Suzuki's played his hand far too early, and it all comes across as a rush job. Also, I say about being willing to wait a few more years for the game to ensure it's of a high quality, yet that makes me impatient? Sound logic there pal!


Jesus, lighten up and let other people be positive.


Um, what? When did we enter the anti-matter universe? My whole point was how the negativity is justified. I clearly said that peeps can be positive, negative or neutral. It's the "let's be positive guys" who're tryna quash the negativity. People can read in your part of the country, right?
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby shredingskin » Wed Jun 24, 2015 3:52 pm

Things I don't agree with MiTT3NZ:
- Saying from the first moment that the "dream game" should be 10 million would be a kickstarter harakiri, it's just too much for any game kickstarter.
- Simplified stretch goals don't seem like a good incentive, I think that people feel better when they think they're achieving things, I even think that closer stretches would be better.
- Suzuki did various interviews, but mostly for japanese media. But also sony talked about Shenmue in most post E3 recaps.

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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby Doom_Infinite » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:09 pm

Suzuki seems to know what he wants, but he wants to include the fans since this is being crowdfunded. It's not rare for games even in production to make significant changes.
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby Mystere » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:15 pm

MiTT3NZ wrote:
Mystere wrote:
MiTT3NZ wrote: We're only at that figure because it's been poorly handled. I feel that Suzuki's played his hand far too early, and it all comes across as a rush job. Also, I say about being willing to wait a few more years for the game to ensure it's of a high quality, yet that makes me impatient? Sound logic there pal!


Jesus, lighten up and let other people be positive.


Um, what? When did we enter the anti-matter universe? My whole point was how the negativity is justified. I clearly said that peeps can be positive, negative or neutral. It's the "let's be positive guys" who're tryna quash the negativity. People can read in your part of the country, right?


OP tells people to be positive, you launch into rants spread across 4 pages about how positivity is oppressing your negativity. That's what I read. Oh please... You didn't have to click the topic. As shredingskin said, constructive criticism is one thing - but launching into a round of fucks about how everything is shit is another. We're all aware of the Kickstarter's issues but we should be trying to address them (as many are) and last time I checked, that takes --- you guessed it (or did you?)

Clue: not negativity.
Last edited by Mystere on Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby south carmain » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:19 pm

Instead of targeting wherever he's negative or not you could target his points instead? It would make for a much less pointless discussion in my opinion as something of worth would actually be discussed.
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby Himuro » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:22 pm

His concerns have been noted across many threads and many even agree that they are legitimate, but the way he goes about it just feels forced. Also, there's so many Britons on this forum that i'm starting to read my posts as if I'm British.
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby south carmain » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:24 pm

That's just the way mittz is. Don't be over-sensitive and you'll get on just fine.
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby JC 2K3 » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:27 pm

MiTT3NZ wrote:
mrandyk wrote: I'm going to agree with whoever said you are more interested in finding something to bitch about. Negativity isn't necessarily unwarranted, but be constructive about it.


...


The seemingly lacking effort in terms of promoting the kickstarter and engaging with fans could also be an indicator that how much more crowdfunding it gets doesn't really matter, and they already have significant funding from other parties (possibly funding that was contingent on the performance of the kickstarter).
Oh, and btw you are a dickhead.

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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby Himuro » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:27 pm

But my reaction is that HE'S being over sensitive. :heart: :rotflmao:
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Re: There Is No Reason For Negativity

Postby south carmain » Wed Jun 24, 2015 4:29 pm

JC 2K3 wrote:
MiTT3NZ wrote:
mrandyk wrote: I'm going to agree with whoever said you are more interested in finding something to bitch about. Negativity isn't necessarily unwarranted, but be constructive about it.


...


The seemingly lacking effort in terms of promoting the kickstarter and engaging with fans could also be an indicator that how much more crowdfunding it gets doesn't really matter, and they already have significant funding from other parties (possibly funding that was contingent on the performance of the kickstarter).

I don't think Yu Suzuki is the type of man to lie about that but what would I know, I've never even met the man to be fair.
Himuro wrote:But my reaction is that HE'S being over sensitive. :heart: :rotflmao:

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