No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

(Chapter 7 and beyond)

Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Hazuki00 » Wed Dec 07, 2016 4:20 pm

SheepheadCG wrote:
sand4fish wrote:
ChiefNeo wrote: Fan feedback scares me.


I wouldn't worry about it too much. Yu has such a strong vision for S3. We have even heard from Cedric that they have fallen out a couple of times because Yu wouldn't stand down on certain things in regards to the budget. I really don't think he is going to compromise his vision of a game that he has been think about for 16+ years, just because some people write mean things on the net. If there are things that will make the player experience better, like changes to movement etc, then I'm sure he will be all ears, but if it it is something that changes the core game and the Shenmue experience, I doubt he will budge lol
He knows what he wants, and I don't think anyone will be able to change his mind.


THIS!

At first I thought the same, but Yu has been thinking about Shenmue and how to make it real for more than 15 years, I doubt his opinion will vary because some fans tell him some ideas. If it's for improve the game I think he will be all ears but changing his original idea...I can´t see this happening.

Besides, when they release the demo will be near imposible to change the natural course of the game, it will be very advanced and making changes would cost too much time to make them.
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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Hazuki00 » Wed Dec 07, 2016 4:32 pm

Please, stop the discusion, shall we?
I think this, the shenmue community is one of the best, if no the best communitys about videogames.

We all love Shenmue, we have been waiting for this for more than 15 years, we should do whatever is in our hand to make Shenmue 3 profitable in order to get Shenmue 4. We can't do nothing but wait for them to release the game and info whenever they CAN.

There are already some people on the kickstarter page whining because Shenmue 3 didn't appear at psx, insulting Suzuki saying his is a drunken and so. The last thing we must do is something like this.
I was so disapointed about psx but I understand making a game takes a lot of time (years) and I don't have waited 15 years for ruining all of the sudden because they don't release as much info as I want.

Please, this discussion follow path to nowhere, let's put a end to this.
Peace!

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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Spaghetti » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:03 pm

I don't think there's particularly much reason to fear feedback coming from the trial next year.

It's locked behind a higher tier, so I don't particularly think we have to fear anything from "casuals" who pledged for the $29/$60 versions of the game and never looked back.

The trial is likely a really good opportunity to point out little adjustments that would improve the mechanics, game flow, or adding "quality of life" improvements (timeskip, for example). We shouldn't really be afraid of it.

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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby sand4fish » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:05 pm

Hazuki00 wrote: Please, stop the discusion, shall we?
I think this, the shenmue community is one of the best, if no the best communitys about videogames.

We all love Shenmue, we have been waiting for this for more than 15 years, we should do whatever is in our hand to make Shenmue 3 profitable in order to get Shenmue 4. We can't do nothing but wait for them to release the game and info whenever they CAN.

There are already some people on the kickstarter page whining because Shenmue 3 didn't appear at psx, insulting Suzuki saying his is a drunken and so. The last thing we must do is something like this.
I was so disapointed about psx but I understand making a game takes a lot of time (years) and I don't have waited 15 years for ruining all of the sudden because they don't release as much info as I want.

Please, this discussion follow path to nowhere, let's put a end to this.
Peace!


Unfortunately I have to disagree. I would really shrug this off if I didn't think it was a serious matter here. Ignoring this will not make this issue go away, but on the contrary I fear it might probably make it bigger later on down the road and with serious repercussions. Imagine if the scenario of the team being heavily criticized by the media becomes true, because some fans were discontent with not being 100% in the loop on the game development process. How much time and money must Yu's team use to fix the problem? Everyone loses. So it's better trying to come to a consensus now than regret not doing anything later. This topic will always come back after any little disappointment fans might feel towards the project.

I'm really trying to be informative here and with hopefully reasonable arguments, and be as courteous as I can (No cursing names on my part). I don't need people to be on my side, but I really need people to understand how Kickstarter works and the rights people are entitled to as a backer. Even if people are discontent with how the process is moving and still decide to act, I just want to make sure they are fully aware of the consequences of doing something like "reporting" them to the media. Money and time are at stake here. Once again there will be no winners in the end if that happens.

And to be clear, I have no ill feelings towards fellow member Himuro. I respect her for being a passionate fan and her work on hyping the campaign. I just happen to strongly disagree with her stance on this matter.

Last edited by sand4fish on Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Himuro » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:22 pm

sand4fish wrote:
Himuro wrote: At this point, I'm guessing that if you criticize Shenmue III upon release you might even be banned. How dare you criticize our lord and savior!


Really? After you saying that Shenmue 3 deserves SO MUCH that it MUST have a E3 screening because it's an equal to a title like Final Fantasy VII Remake (without a solid base for such opinionated claim), you really dare to imply that the rest of us are simply fanboys?

Himuro wrote: Sandfish said I want constant promotion. I really don't. I just want an update on the game and do not find the recent updates satisfactory. I do expect to see an update before E3, but if they don't have one as the OP of this thread surmises, then they have left their hands to fate.

I find my position fairly logical and reasonable. Certainly, after having the support of over 70k people world wide, Yu and his team would agree that not having an big update on how the project is going before or during E3 would be unacceptable. Only a complete fanboy would argue otherwise.

If they haven't shown anything before and during E3 then I mean, it's on their inaction to show the fruits of their labor that has the sum of nearly 7 million dollars over of 70k people's hopes. The fact that they'd not show anything before or during E3 despite those numbers is begging for bad press anyways. Also, this has more to do with the trailer and more to do with what they're doing with peoples money if they have managed to miss two E3's in a row. Concern for the status of the development would legitimate, especially with a supposed December 2017 release date.


How would I know that you will not want more after your demands are met? When usually threats are attended to, it just means they work and now people feel like they gained power in their hands. It's just a natural course to continue doing so. And soon other people will follow (or did you think you are the only one with wants and needs?) Do you see the really DANGEROUS TREND you are trying to set here? Even if you don't follow through your intentions, others might think it's okay to threaten the development team to get what they want. When said demands can't be met, Ysnet will have to waste money and resources just for damage control and waste time (which is literally our money) that would be otherwise spent on making the game.

Please answer me this: What real difference does it make if a "substantial trailer" is shown RIGHT NOW or 2 years from now in the long run? After all people know the game has evolved to some extent, because some backers have already seen it. And there's simply no fact that keeping up with "substantial updates" (and of the like suggested documentaries and creation of in game items) will bring worthwhile money to cover its costs (unless you show me the numbers or statistics for comparison). But it's a logical conclusion that it will be detrimental to the final product, because the team will have to allocate more time and money (resources that we paid for) on making fans "happy" that could be focused solely on the development process of the game. The opportunity cost Yu chose in the end is the wise one, as seen with other successful Kickstarters. How am I a fanboy here? I really think what I wrote so far makes sense.

I noticed also that you, Himuro, wrote some post about how the entire campaign could be improved. First of all, most of the suggestions are just to keep fans "happy" while waiting for the final product and it does not improve on the game itself which is all we really care about in the end. Your jacket suggestion actually just makes the entire gaming process harder. Besides having to go through the trouble of creating such artifact, they have to test it throughout the final build for possible crashes and bugs. Plus it will be another added promise that Yu will have to fulfill to the backers in the end. Where does the laundry list stop for such a limited budget and small scale team? And FYI any company or organization has room for process improvement, including your workplace or business. There're entire jobs just focused on that area. So don't just go treat everyone like idiots as if no one knows what they are doing, but a few selected non fanboys. We don't even know at what capacity the jobs of the members from Awesome Japan extends to in the end. Probably Yu would have to raise their salary in order for them to perform according to your standards.
And if you are still so keen on improving whatever it's being done, why not do it yourself? Go draft those improvements and send to them. The team will surely make some good use of your improvement suggestions if it's within their job description and capacity. Otherwise talk is easy to go around and everyone just loves to play the boss.

Himuro wrote:The entire discussion is circular and no one is budging an inch.


Not circular at all. I have no beef with you. I apologize if any of this offends or insults you. I certainly know you are as passionate about Shenmue 3 as the rest of the community. My only intention is just to STOP YOU from planting these ideas to other people that just because you are a backer Ysnet has to listen to you. Threats are not okay. You are willing to take measures to your own hands while not having the consensus from the rest of the community. I just hope that with my posts people understand that no one here is a shareholder of the company and Ynet has no OBLIGATION whatsoever to entertain backers, and not even promote Shenmue 3. Their only obligation toward us all is to deliver a finished game some time in the future (no deadlines requirements, read carefully the stipulations of a Kickstarter project), and the respective perks for those who paid for them. Just let them do their jobs.
So far, the project is on track as some backers already witnessed further development of the game process, unless you want to doubt them. There have been consistent updates (in the form of small interviews mostly) just to let people know that the project is doing okay. There are simply no red flags at all.

Sorry for the long post and thank you to those who read it.


You know what, you're right. I cooled off today for whatever reason and I agree with you. I will not apologize for my behavior because it's how I felt at the time but reconsidering it, I'd say you're right.

As for a trial, I don't view it as necessarily a good thing but also not a bad thing. I will be playing the trial so I can give Ys Net my thoughts on it so I can see if it presents a pure Shenmue experience and I will be articulating this to them through my impressions of the trial. I think the more Shenmue fans who play the trial and give Ys Net impressions the better the final game will turn out. If a lot of us fans don't get the trial because of a fear of spoilers or a pure experience, we are allowing non-fans to articulate their thoughts the most. This cannot happen and we must make it a priority to give the team our thoughts as fans.

And you're right I'm passionate about Shenmue, if my posts hopefully have shown you.

I will definitely be writing drafts on how the KS can be improved and send it to them. I hope I get a response.

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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby sand4fish » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:29 pm

Thank you Himuro! Know that I really was not trying to win an argument against you over this issue. I'm really invested on this game as you are, and I was only really trying to give out as many facts or reasonable arguments for the cause. Once again forgive me if anything I wrote came out as an insult.

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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Himuro » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:31 pm

No, you didn't insult me at all. You were fair and amicable.
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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Himuro » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:34 pm

Axm wrote: Sorry I wrote too much but please read!

Please don't take this as condescending.
Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but I beg of you Himuro or anyone else.. please god don't try to out Shenmue 3 in a bad light to the vicious media. Sites like Kotaku, Giant Bomb and other blog style gaming news sites are itching to vomit out anything negative about Shenmue they can get away with on any angle. They will turn a speed bump into a volcano for weeks and tank public perception to an un-reboundable level.

I already have my doubts that no matter what happens, Shenmue 3 will be thrown into the fires of game news media sites at the slightest hint that the game isnt immaculate perfection.

Bottom line, I'm sure we will have plenty of non-Shenmue fans rip us and the project to shreds if the opportunity arrises. Spare us that coming from our own community. I didn't stay here for over a decade dealing with every twist and heart wrenching turn to just end up being disappointed we couldn't deal with things together as a team.

And neither did so many others even more dedicated to the community than me, all working on things for cheap to free just for our benefit.
Think of Yama who re-built this site from the ground up while the series was at its worst publicly. Ziming who maintains a constant care over content. Peter, LanDC, Switch, OL, LetsGetSweaty I could go on and on without even mentioning 500k, Team Yu and other international communities. These are all real people who a majority are VERY patient and would wait another 15 years aslong as its guaranteed.

Himuro, you're totally welcome to be here in our family. We all want fans who truely love the series to discuss things with us fairly. I know some others out there feel as you do too and that makes you justified in ways, but lets keep things in here with us to make a unified positive impact together. :)


Okay. :(

From :agrue: to :heart: I guess.
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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby The_Fuzileiro » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:37 pm

Twelve pages of discussion made just because of PSX deception. I'm gonna laugh when the day finally comes, but, until then guys... please, share the love you've learned with Shenmue.

I was also upset... as everyone, but still have the same trust and confidence in Yu Suzuki. Calm down people!
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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby delvec19 » Wed Dec 07, 2016 5:57 pm

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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Valascaziel » Wed Dec 07, 2016 6:58 pm

It's like I said--it's all been more of debate than mudslinging.

I'm excited to see what is planned for years end, plus in the months to come. If it does indeed get publicly shown at E3 2017, it could really be a treat.

E3 2015 from Sony is considered to be the E3 of Dreams. I'd imagine 2017 would be better, as imagine this--

FInal Fantasy VII, Shenmue III, Last of Us 2 and God of War. All four will have had substantial development time to blow us away by June 2017. Nothing MS or Nintendo could show could top in-depth trailers of those four, not including whatever else Sony resurrects to coincide alongside these.

Legend of Dragoon, please...please.

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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Himuro » Wed Dec 07, 2016 7:02 pm

Legend of Dragoon really does deserve another chance.
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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby ChiefNeo » Wed Dec 07, 2016 7:12 pm

Himuro wrote: Legend of Dragoon really does deserve another chance.



Skies of Arcadia HD???

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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Himuro » Wed Dec 07, 2016 7:17 pm

ChiefNeo wrote:
Himuro wrote: Legend of Dragoon really does deserve another chance.



Skies of Arcadia HD???


We can only dream. :(
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Re: No Shenmue 3 Until E3 2017!!!

Postby Valascaziel » Wed Dec 07, 2016 7:20 pm

ChiefNeo wrote:
Himuro wrote: Legend of Dragoon really does deserve another chance.



Skies of Arcadia HD???


There is hope. I read this morning both Altered Beast and Streets of Rage are being shipped to be adapted for a TV series.

I dunno. Look for hope wherever.
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