Why Iwao was outclassed by Lan Di??

[Ceej]

Age is a gigantic factor. It's rare to see an athlete competing at the highest levels in their late 30s-early 40s. Iwao is practically ancient at 46.

I'd normally agree with you 100% but Ryo couldn't even lay a hit on Jianmin in Shenmue II and he's 75 years old. Age doesn't seem to factor as much when it comes to Shenmue.

[ÐÃ ß×®]

I find it interesting that you all are debating this and not the fact that he LET Ryo live.

Was he not in the same position when his own father got killed?

One would think he'd learn from that and kill the son as well.

Now you got one mad motherfucker after you seeking revenge on you.

Or maybe Lan Di counted on Ryo going after him? Kind of like having a death wish.

[Calshot]

Age is a gigantic factor. It's rare to see an athlete competing at the highest levels in their late 30s-early 40s. Iwao is practically ancient at 46.

I'd normally agree with you 100% but Ryo couldn't even lay a hit on Jianmin in Shenmue II and he's 75 years old. Age doesn't seem to factor as much when it comes to Shenmue.

That's because Shenmue abides by the rules of kung fu movies, where there can be wisened 100 year old Chinese men where your level of kung fu is the only thing that determines your fighting ability.

[Mr357]

I find it interesting that you all are debating this and not the fact that he LET Ryo live.

Was he not in the same position when his own father got killed?

One would think he'd learn from that and kill the son as well.

Now you got one mad motherfucker after you seeking revenge on you.

Or maybe Lan Di counted on Ryo going after him? Kind of like having a death wish.

This has stood out to me too. Xiuying says that she heard Lan Di has no mercy, but he let both Ryo and Fuku-san live despite them being witnesses and getting in his way.

[SMDzero]

It would be cool if Ryo beats Lan Di and then moments before landing the killer blow he notices a boy who he recognizes and Lan Di's son.

Then the "bad" ending of Shenmue 5 could be Lan Di's son walking around Meng Cun asking "On that day did you see anyone who looked Japanese? He wore a brown leather jacket...."

[Hyo Razuki]

I don't know if age was that big of a factor. At least in Western Martial Arts, you can see fighters well above Lan Di's age still competing at a world level. Take Heavyweight Boxing for example. Lennox Lewis was around 38 years old when he had his last Title defending Match. Vitaly Klitschko was also in his late 30s or early 40s when he last defended his world champion title(s). In fact, now that Vitaly retired, Wladimir is the strongest heavyweight fighter in the world right now and he's around 40 years old, too.

Then again, Lan Di and Iwao are both not nearly as heavy as those guys. I guess Lan Di was in fact clearly better than Iwao, but then again why didn't he jump onto the roof of Big Ox Building and get rid of Ryo for good? Was he afraid Ryo and Ren together could be too much for him, also taking into account that Ren is well known to always carry a knvie in Hong Kong?

I don't know, tbh. Lan Di is better than Iwao but then again not strong enough to beat Ryo AND Ren in a 2 on 1 fight, I guess. Then again, why didn't Lan Di kill Ryo in the Hazuki Dojo? Of course, the answer could be that it was for us to be able to play Shenmue but i hope we'll get a satisfactory answer to that one day. There must be a reason within Lan Di to let Ryo live.

No matter what way you look at it, it is indeed puzzling. Let's hope we'll get the answer some day.

[Ceej]

I don't know if age was that big of a factor. At least in Western Martial Arts, you can see fighters well above Lan Di's age still competing at a world level. Take Heavyweight Boxing for example. Lennox Lewis was around 38 years old when he had his last Title defending Match. Vitaly Klitschko was also in his late 30s or early 40s when he last defended his world champion title(s). In fact, now that Vitaly retired, Wladimir is the strongest heavyweight fighter in the world right now and he's around 40 years old, too.

Then again, Lan Di and Iwao are both not nearly as heavy as those guys. I guess Lan Di was in fact clearly better than Iwao,

but then again why didn't he jump onto the roof of Big Ox Building and get rid of Ryo for good? Was he afraid Ryo and Ren together could be too much for him, also taking into account that Ren is well known to always carry a knvie in Hong Kong

I don't know, tbh. Lan Di is better than Iwao but then again not strong enough to beat Ryo AND Ren in a 2 on 1 fight, I guess. Then again, why didn't Lan Di kill Ryo in the Hazuki Dojo? Of course, the answer could be that it was for us to be able to play Shenmue but i hope we'll get a satisfactory answer to that one day. There must be a reason within Lan Di to let Ryo live.

No matter what way you look at it, it is indeed puzzling. Let's hope we'll get the answer some day.

I'm pretty sure Lan Di could take Ryo and Ren pretty easily at that point. Maybe he just doesn't take Ryo seriously?

In any case, I love how little we actually know about the guy. He's a complete mystery and he's so badass. What an awesome villian!

Also, added Spoiler tags since we're talking about the biggest moment in Shenmue II and we're on the Shenmue I board

[squall]

As far as Iwao goes, I always figured he somewhat didn't put all his effort into the fight. I figure he felt he was more likely to save Ryo by accepting the fate likely felt he deserved (assuming he felt guilty for killing Zhao). Not that I think he would have beaten Lan Di, but perhaps made more of a battle of it.

I also just tend to think that maybe Lan Di has some amount of honor in leaving Ryo alive. Not so much mercy, or overlooking him as a "witness" but just that the object of his revenge was Iwao. Not Ryo.

I could be completely wrong on both counts.

[Calshot]

I don't know if age was that big of a factor. At least in Western Martial Arts, you can see fighters well above Lan Di's age still competing at a world level. Take Heavyweight Boxing for example. Lennox Lewis was around 38 years old when he had his last Title defending Match. Vitaly Klitschko was also in his late 30s or early 40s when he last defended his world champion title(s). In fact, now that Vitaly retired, Wladimir is the strongest heavyweight fighter in the world right now and he's around 40 years old, too.

Ah, but that's heavyweight boxing. Those two guys you've mentioned had styles that didn't rely entirely on their athletic abilities, so they managed to still remain competitive. A guy like Tyson though who relied on his speed ended up losing more often as he aged (though there were other factors of course). You could also make the argument that heavyweight divisions in general aren't very deep in terms of competition, which allows the better skilled guys to dominate despite their age.

[amiga1200]

i maybe onto something here?
ryo wasn't wasted as a child possibly because:
1, on the surface, ryo is far from a threat, lan-di is as driven as a military Commanding officer, and won't stray from the objectives, or be distracted.
2, more likely, a twisted form of honour.
there's a code of conduct in some cases, this i believe to be one of them.
if lan-di lives by a similar (yet skewed) code, then he's honour bound to to wait for ryo to approach him in combat, implying ryo is therefore ready to be exterminated according to the honour code of lan-di.
maybe he wants an equal?
a worthy opponent?
just stabbing here guys, but if i was lan-di, i'd have destroyed all evidence and resistance, left NOTHING to chance, so?!?!?!? (could be wrong here, it's the conclusion i've reached given what i've seen in the first tow chapters of the shenmue saga. )

[Benwah]

I have a couple of issues with people's theories.

1. Iwao didn't know who Lan Di was (his connection with his best friend) until he had already been knocked down by Lan Di. For me this shows that it wasn't a sense of guilt that affected Iwao, it's just that either Iwao had lost a step due to his age or Lan Di was just better than him.

2. The skewed honour theory for Lan Di is flawed. Ryo attempts to attack Lan Di on multiple occasions, so there would have been no issue for Lan Di to have killed both Ryo and Fuku-San.

My personal theory as to why Lan Di allowed Ryo to live is that he has gone through the pain of losing his father due to Iwao. He avenged his father by killing Iwao, but he is avenging himself by making Iwao's son go through the same torment that he has gone through.

[Samanosuke Akechi]

From the letter you find in Iwaos room,he knew Lan Di was going to be looking for him. My best guess is that Iwao was ready for the repercussions of his actions in Meng Cun and accepted his fate.

[KiBa]

So that when Lan Di would strike him down, he would become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.

[Supa]

I always thought Lan Di was just better than Iwao, but there are several good points raised in this thread, specifically that even though Iwao may or may not have been 100% guilty of murdering Zhao Sunming, he may feel some of that guilt.

It is also known that Lan Di received the order directly from Tentei to retrieve the mirrors. Maybe he would've had to answer to Tentei if he had killed anybody other than Iwao?

Re: Lan Di not coming off of the helicopter to kill Ryo...I always thought he didn't take Ryo seriously, and/or he was in a major rush to get to Bailu Village. I feel we will know the truth to this one in Shenmue III, more than likely very soon into the story.

[SMDzero]

Yeah Lan Di was also surprised and fascinated that Ryo had tracked him all the way from Yokosuka and also respected Ryo as a warrior after he beat Don Niu. If he had gotten off the chapter he would have killed Ryo in 5 seconds and he didn't want to do that at least yet.

Regarding Iwao's skills... do you think he could beat Xiuying in a one on one fight?